The truth behind scam links

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John V55
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The truth behind scam links

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For those new to TEFL in China, one fact remains undisputed. For the unwary, China is a disaster waiting to happen!

There are no end to the scams available and often those pretending to help (and that includes foreigners) are the biggest culprits. Where do you want to start? Chinese Foreign Teachers Union (CFTU)? Reddit, Scam Busters? China Scam patrol? China Scam Central? … Take your pick, because although claiming to be independent, if you look closely, they’re all interlinked. That’s not to say there might not be altruistic motives behind some of these volunteers that do the link posting, but just as the sites they’re pointing you to, you’ll never find out who they are either.
To be fair, there’s is good information on these sites sometimes, but that’s to draw you in.

You’re new right? How does 20, or 30,000 Yuan a month sound, plus all the perks? Twenty thousand Yuan is the equivalent of $3000, or 2,200 GBP. Sound fair? Now add on the freebies of medical care, free holiday air flights, holiday pay and that’s got to be worth at least another $300, or 200 GBP a month. Add on that the cost of living in China is probably a third of what it is in the west and suddenly, being able to speak English, your new degree and a week long TEFL course makes you worth the equivalent spending power in the west of $10,000, or 7,000 GBP a month? As much as you’d like to think it does, it doesn’t, does it. Make no mistake, after your net pay, sharing a dingy apartment, paying the utility bills and being worked into the ground, your 20,000 will be a distant memory.

Enter the scams and CFTU, which is where it all leads back to. You all know, or should do that all unions in China are state controlled. Which means, an allegedly independent CFTU shouldn’t exist, but because it does, it’s serving someone’s purpose and they’re operating with permission of the government and Public Security Bureau (PSB). As much as you’d like to think everyone is bending over backwards to help you, no one goes to the trouble of operating a complex trail of similar websites, volunteers and floods the Internet with interlinking sites for your benefit. Someone is making money out of all this and it’s not going to be you.

So why are they doing it? You’ll never find out and if you go to these sites, no one will tell you either, but they’ll all tell you you’re being cheated and to go to the CFTU. What are the benefits of joining? Hard to say, but I rather suspect the police will very quickly have your email, with it your location and note you as possible troublemaker and by even joining a foreign ‘union’, you’d already be breaking internal law.

This afternoon, I sat down and worked out my hourly rate. I work a minimum of hours and after tax it’s around 375 an hour, ($56.5, or 42 GBP). Subtract a monthly 300 Yuan tax ($45, or 34 GBP), but add onto that free (not shared and within the school) accommodation and all utilities, Internet, health care, 60% holiday pay, a 7000 Yuan annual holiday flight, 1000 Yuan monthly food allowance and make that hourly figure into what you think it’s worth.
There’s nothing special about me and I’m not anonymous either, with a bit of experience anyone can get that, but you won’t get it listening to anonymous posters that lure you into believing the sky’s the limit and point you in the direction they’ve been told to send you.
Now, all that’s about 600 words, without one scammy link!
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Joe
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Re: The truth behind scam links

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Always good to see a post with actual content
"We are not wholly bad or good, who live our lives under Milk Wood :? " — Dylan Thomas, Under Milk Wood

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Re: The truth behind scam links

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Thanks Joe. I feel sorry for the younger ones who are told to focus on salary amounts. Wherever you come from, China is a long way from home and it’s a nail biting time. On the one hand you’ve got the lure of adventure and excitement, yet on the other the two legged sharks are queuing up to pounce on the unwary.

You’re worth more than that!

The higher salary you expect and the higher amount you’re told by others you deserve, the more likely you are to be scammed, until eventually you end up in the murky world of, "We have hundreds of jobs available (but we’re not telling you where); at 20,000 a month (no TEFL cert’ or degree required)."! No state school would ever pay that, because unless you had a Ph.D in education, you’re simply not worth it and that’s the bottom line. Those sort of ‘private’ school ads is where the scams occur and the deported frauds come from.

"Five vacancies for performing foreign monkey entertainers required, as our previous lot have all done midnight runs, or been arrested. No teaching required. Free lessons on how to make a degree certificate using Microsoft word. 20,000 negotiable salary, depending on whatever I decide to pay you."

Happy Sally School @keep’emhappyandkeepthecashtillsringing.com

Testimonials:

"So I said to the PSB, I said, you can’t touch me, Sally told me she has connections." - #457389 Joe.

"Imagine my disappointment when I discovered the 20,000 was a typo and I got 2,000." - Jane, ‘Home Alone’ on welfare.

"I asked the police, how did you know my bought degree was a forgery? They said Sally’s email as the issuing authority gave it away." - Silly Me (texted from PEK International departure terminal).

From rags to riches, honest, would I lie to you, I promise …

All this caters to personal greed and if you’re totally fixated on how much you can squeeze out of someone, you can’t complain if they do the same with you. These link sites prey on greed; how many mention salaries based on experience, or having man management skills, or anything remotely connected with the abilities required to teach? How many of our linkers have even written a paragraph on anything even remotely connected with teaching? That itself is a warning of an agenda.

Of course recruiters take a cut of salaries, in my school I believe it’s about 7,000 a month, but why shouldn’t they? They’re not social work departments, they’re businesses, but the individual should always focus on how much they’re getting, not what everyone else is making. If you settle for 10 to 15,000 and you get that and you’re happy and the recruiter is happy making a nice profit from you, who cares what everyone else is making. Of course I’m worth 50,000 a month, it’s just that no one else but the scammers agree. :)

Home, home on the range, where no wannabes or gullible roam, where seldom is heard a discouraging word and the scammers aren’t at it all day

My wife is a dependent here and so I have to pay for her. Yet even with that, I’ve managed to pay off a mortgage in SE Asia without even trying, because just about all my daily living costs are free. Minus national and local holidays, my working year is under 40 weeks. I’m not worked into the ground, the school and the company I work for are happy to keep me on year after year instead of burning me out with work overload and I don’t have any horror stories to give of shared apartments and midnight runs. Conversely, I’ve met those that have chased the dollar, been down the annual private ‘school’ hopping route, had five jobs in as many years and unsurprisingly, have empty bank accounts and no references either.

I’m told, poor John. Stuck in the outer reaches of Inner Mongolia. You’d earn far more in Shanghai, or Beijing. Some maths; 20,000 a month, less say 3000 tax and a couple more towards utilities and travel is around 15,000. At 100 hours a month, that’s 150 an hour. If you CFTU SJWs are on that, you’re the ones being scammed, not me.

Shanghai or Beijing? No thanks. Welcome to Inner Mongolia

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Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
Murphy
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Re: The truth behind scam links

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I think everybody see things from different points of view John. I have taught in China now almost a decade now and almost every newbie teacher I meet complains about being ripped off or exploited by their own recruiter or employer. The veteran teachers do not seem to have this problem because they have learned their lessons from personal experience and the help of other teachers, not their employers nor their recruiters.

For example, not one employer of the 5 I have had in 9.5 years nor my original recruiter (name unimportant) ever once told me about the employee rights I had that protected me against exploitation, unpaid overtime, or prevented my employer from using me as a marketing monkey. I found out for free from a CFTU newsletter that I got for free and then three years later I found this post confirming that indeed all expat employees in China have rights. http://opnlttr.com/letter/15-employee-r ... g-enforced. Looking back at your many old posts John, I see you even praised the CFTU a few time and saying they gave valuable information and good advice. However, I never did see you talk about teacher's employee rights.

And before i go further, I want to assure you that I do not belong to any organization in China including the CFTU nor will I ever join any organization in China that has a lot of foreigners in it simply because the Chinese government is always suspicious of such groups even Bible study classes! The original founders of the China's Teachers Alliance could not get their visa's renewed back in 2008 after they made a lot of noise about foreign teachers being exploited. But even though I will not join such groups does not mean I don't give them my moral support. My ex GF (also a teacher from Minnesota) attended about 5-6 of their meetings back in 2012 just to get information about China Labor Laws, and the truth about China teacher requirements since recruiters often mislead foreign job applicants on this issue. http://opnlttr.com/letter/top-10-lies-t ... king-china

But getting back to my original comment, depending upon your own experience in China will determine whether your China adventure was a career dream or a nightmare. My own experience has been both frankly. In the beginning, I got crap jobs from my recruiter who I later discovered did not even have a business license and worked only to hit his quota, and not to find me the best possible or most appealing job for me. Say what you will John, but money talks loudest in China. After my second job I wisened up and started finding my own gigs and my pay almost doubled and I got two days off instead of one. Now I am earning almost 30,000 yuan a month doing VIP tutoring and Teacher Training for New Oriental three days a week. So now I have a comfortable and scam-free life. The first two years I was dodging scams and was so frustrated I almost gave up and went home.

I for one appreciate all the white and blacklists put out by the CTA, CFTU, CSP and Scam.com. I still get monthly newsletters from the CFTU and China Scam Patrol but since I probably won't change my job now they are mostly entertainment for me and I pass them along to the newbies I meet so they can learn the China ropes faster than I did. None of those groups sell anything and I never seen them asking anyone for money for anything. So in my opinion, they do more good than harm and my advice for anyone coming to China, is that you must be alert and diligent about where you work and who you give your personal information to. Three of my colleagues were cheated by identity thieves and perhaps a dozen by employers over the years I have been in China. You need not join any groups but I highly recommend that you visit http://reddit.com/r/TEFLscams at least once a month just to keep yourself aware of the people who will be trying to cheat you in China. Btw... This last site even recommends TEFL.net as one of the best and safest job boards for TEFL teaching jobs. So obviously Joe is vetting the employers that advertise here, and I hope he will always do so.

I can only assume that John has not yet been cheated or maybe he is too embarrassed or proud to admit that he was. A lot of my friends do not want to admit that some clever Chinese con artist tricked them into looking like a fool. Just google "China Job Scam" and you will see that it happens every single day in China, Nigerian scams are obvious. China scams are always very well camouflaged. Also, inner Mongolia does not even half the scams that you will find in Beijing, Shanghai, or Guangzhou. Most of the Chinese scammers and black unlicensed schools are in the big Tier 1 cities.
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John V55
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Re: The truth behind scam links

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Come on Murph, you’re slipping. Only three spammy links out in a post of this size? :)

Of course nearly every newbie teacher at the level of school you’re in is complaining and will continue to while they’re drawn into the greed you promote. The greed that has kept you school hopping for nearly a decade and five jobs?
No one told you your obligations and rights? They were in the contract you signed and if you agreed to disregard it and be used, you can’t blame the employer. The rights you have are in your contract, not what CFTU or an open letter tell you they should be.
No Murph, what I said about the CFTU is that they sometimes posted good information to draw people in and by receiving their newsletter, you’re almost definitely on the PSB radar yourself. You see Murph, I can explain without the need to resort to the same type of continual links, over and over and over again, because no one is pulling my strings. On the subject of greed?

Gimee more!

Let’s say your on 20,000, not unreasonable you might say for the expected hours you’re required to do, the short holidays and things you need to pay for yourself. Add onto that the recruiters commission, which is probably another 10 and another 10 for all the freebies of holiday air flights, health insurance, or whatever. We’re now at 40. OK, take off ten if you’re dealing with this so-called ‘school’ itself and we’ll call it 30. 30,000 is someone paying $54,200, or 40,400 GBP a year for your services.

How many of you were on a net pay of around 2000 GBP a month, or $2,600 back in your home countries and before you ask, yes I was. Now, what you need to do is explain what skills and/or knowledge you have that makes you think you’re worth anywhere near that, never mind complaining you want more and that’s in a developing country, where your salary purchasing power goes even further.

The people who employ you at the bottom end of the private TEFL tier already know this and the scammers are well aware that they are able to play on your greed to lure you in with even higher amounts and hence the proliferation of these sites that tell you no matter what you already earn, you’re being cheated and you should be earning more. Those that are on the 20+ soon find that after their daily expenses, the 20+ has dramatically lessened. Those that are more realistic find that they live for free and get to spend, with plenty left over. Get yourself a real teaching job instead of chasing the dollar and you wouldn’t have all the problems you’re now complaining about.

Now come on Grizzly, Nathan, Saturn, Norman, who’s next to answer with the same spam links. :) I’ll get bored with it all in time as I’ve had my say, but you’ll do as someone else tells you and keep ‘em coming, won’t you. :)
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Murphy »

I read where you said recruiters should take 7,000 a month from a teacher's salary which is about $1,000 per month or $12,000 a year. That is outrageous John. Most professional headhunters only take one month's salary as their fee. I agree they should not work for free but your 7,000 per month suggestion is exorbitant and shameful IMO.

And stop the BS about trying to smear everyone who disagrees with you as some secret member of the CFTU. Maybe just maybe you can somehow accept the possibility that you can be wrong about something once in a while ????? So far, anyone who disagrees with you and posts a link to support their reasons is a member of some cabal and you always call the links spam, even those that originated with the largest English newspaper in China (China Daily) and the Huffington Post!

I will forever disagree with your salary claims and the advice to use job recruiters in China. I cite these links only because they support my point of view which is shared by hundreds, if not thousands of other teachers working in China...

https://www.reddit.com/r/ChinaScamCentr ... t_is_free/

https://www.scam.com/showthread.php?704 ... -BLACKLIST

http://chinascamwatch.org

The bottom line is that when you DIY (do it yourself) and get your own job, you know for a fact there is no middle person that is going to "take a cut" of your pay or smooth-talk you into working for some skanky unlicensed school not even allowed to hire foreign teachers. By doing things yourself yo avoid dozens of scams and the risk of getting arrested for using the wrong visa or fake documents. Simply put, risks are easier to avoid or minimize for people willing to do their own homework and avoid identity thieves, hundreds of which pose as China job recruiters.
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Re: The truth behind scam links

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No, I didn’t say they should take, I said they do take. It’s why there’s so much competition between them. Who’s going to bend over backwards and even break the law for a one off 7,000 fee.

Most of you have already admitted previous involvement with the CFTU and you personally get the newsletter, but of course, despite all the links, you’re unbiased, right?

I’ve never disputed a DIY approach, what I dispute is the greed you promote by the links you post to. It doesn’t matter whether it’s a recruiter or school, your constant fixation about money means you’ll always be a target and always have problems.

Murph, stop and think for a moment. ‘Me, affiliated to CFTU? Just because I endlessly post to spam links, get their news letter and tell everyone one they’re being cheated?’ Yes Murph, something like that. It’s so obvious it’s embarrassing. Do you think is only this site that experiences this? You volunteers are all over the Internet saying the same thing and linking out to the same sites!
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

I’d like to think your individually misguided, but when I see a handful of you engaged in exactly the same sort of behaviour, at the same time, replicated across the Internet, I know where it’s coming from. You think you’re the only ones? ‘Hey guys, I just discovered a great site and this one, oh and another one and wow look at this one …’ with links in every post, pointing towards Reddit, open letter, the various scam buster ones and the CFTU, all with the same agenda behind them? Do you really think anyone believes a bunch of identical and anonymous spam linkers?

By the way Murph, you are aware that the company you say you work for and doing great on your 30K a month, ‘New Oriental’ is itself on a TEFL blacklist? You must realise that your 30K means your employer is actually paying around $72,000 a year with the extra add-ons for a TEFL teacher in China? Are you having a laugh? :lol: Yet there again, who knows who you work for, or even if you’re in China, but I know who’s behind you.

http://teflblacklist.blogspot.com/2006/ ... guage.html

‘I will not go into the lengthy criticisms written by the Washington Post or several Chinese newspapers have to say about this dreadful place and its owners. Perhaps I'll reserve that for a later post. But as for Beijing New Oriental Foreign Language School (BNOFLS)...
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Murphy »

John, to be crystal clear there is nobody "behind" me and nobody in front of me or even beside me other than my wife. I speak for myself and only myself. Your CFTU conspiracy drumbeat is getting stale and annoying. But at least we both agree that the DIY route is the best way to go in China. Btw... I found this 2017 China blacklist at http://reddit.com/r/Tefl_tips_traps_scams and I think it is worth sharing https://www.slideshare.net/LaowaiCareer ... l-teachers

Last but not least, this is what most of my colleagues use to avoid stepping in China's foulest shit and surprise - it has nothing to do with your beloved CFTU John... https://www.scam.com/showthread.php?704 ... -BLACKLIST
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

Well no, we don’t necessarily agree. There are both good and bad recruiters, but yes, at the private bottom tier of private ‘school’ TEFL, there are probably more bad ones than good ones and it’s where the scams, the fraud and deportations come from. That’s not rocket science. It’s less to do with ‘schools’ and recruiters than it is to do with personal greed.

Let’s cut out the middleman of scambusters, open letters, anonymous volunteer posters and go directly to the man himself. Enter the CFTU main page and having only got half way down, I already spot inaccuracies.
Let’s forget that, so that it’s available to those that have worked elsewhere and know it’s rubbish. We read on and discover the main page is a replica of all the other links, but yes we know that, they’ve been placed there by the same people, so that’s not a surprise. So what’s the underlying point. Join our union, get our newsletter. Well OK then, let’s do that and what will happen? We’ll magically create an anti-scam link around us, the 30 and 40,000 salaries will appear, free VPN’s for the taking and maybe get rich without even teaching ... You know what Murph? That sounds exactly like the scams they’re warning about.

I too could anonymously write open letters, set up a cheap or free website and tell everyone I’ve discovered something that everyone knows is obvious, reel ‘em in, promise them the world; just like all the other scammers do. Even set up my own recommended white list … Oh, CFTU already do, don’t they. That’s amazing. No one goes to all this trouble to actively promote themselves for free and the CFTU is no different. Someone is making a lot of money from all this and it isn’t you Murph.

The bottom line is this: If you choose to swim in the shark infested waters of privatised TEFL, down with the shared apartments, 25 hours + a week, the frauds, illegals and money grabbers … you’ll get what you deserve and it won’t be 30, 000 a month! With that I’ve had my say and realise that the more I post about this, the more it gives you lot an opportunity to include further spam links.

A repeat hint, for who you now say you work for Murph (who knows) and are doing so well.
http://teflblacklist.blogspot.com/2006/ ... guage.html

‘I will not go into the lengthy criticisms written by the Washington Post or several Chinese newspapers have to say about this dreadful place and its owners. Perhaps I'll reserve that for a later post. But as for Beijing New Oriental Foreign Language School (BNOFLS)...

So, I’ll reiterate. For those coming to China, stay away from these scammy interlinked sites and anything to so with a so-called foreign ‘union’, which by definition is illegal. Make sure you have the correct qualifications and paperwork. Try to get into government schools or Universities, where you’ll at least be protected by SAFEA. Don’t concentrate on anonymous people telling you it’s all about making money and their salary fantasies in cash register so-called ‘schools’. If you go down the road of applying to a recruiter, which is the majority applying in the west, forget the white and black lists and stick to reputable International recruiters. Teaching anywhere has never been a get rich quick opportunity. Don’t be misled by listening to those that tell you that if only you join their organisation you’ll suddenly be scam proof and earn loads of money. The only thing you’ll get is a mention on the PSB watch list of potential trouble-making foreigners.
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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John V55
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

P.S
‘Last but not least, this is what most of my colleagues use to avoid stepping in China's foulest shit and surprise - it has nothing to do with your beloved CFTU John... showthread.php?704 ... -BLACKLIST’

‘You can get the complete blacklist maintained by the CFTU which is updated every three months here chinaforeignteachersunion.org.’

Of course it does, why lie Murph, the link is there a quarter down the page, with exactly all the other scam buster links you few are pointing to! Dishonesty and preying on potential new arrivals before they even get here, anonymously boasting of fantastic salaries in blacklisted schools, whilst trying to reel people in to your agenda … the sooner they clear you scam linking vultures out the better! :)
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Murphy
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Murphy »

John, that old TEFL Blacklist link you gave goes back to 2007 and the CFTU was not even born then so I don't see how you can link one to the other. Personally I prefer the reddit format where anyone can chime in and have there say and when 80% of people agree on something, and I see no "removed" editing from mods, I can safely assume they know what they are talking about. Here are three examples of what I mean;

https://www.reddit.com/r/ChinaScamCentr ... _esl_tefl/

https://www.reddit.com/r/ChinaScamCentr ... ftu_china/

https://www.reddit.com/r/ChinaTEFL/comm ... ruiter_is/

And please stop your ad-hominem attacks where you keep suggesting and outright saying I am part of the CFTU. I told you twice that I am not a member, never was and never will be. How can I make it more clear to you? Are you calling me a liar John?

You warn people not to read scam warnings yet you admit China is full of scams. WTF? And I did NOT give you a link to the CFTU blacklist as you said. I gave you a link to the CTA blacklist which has zero to do with the CFTU John. So please stick with facts and stop the BS innuendos. What you are trying to suggest makes no sense and imo all those websites and scam reporting sites come from different sources. For example scam.com is 16 years old and owned by a Russian named George. ESLWatch.info is owned by a man in Spain named Kevin and his site is about 7 years old. The CFTU website went up in 2012 and is own by someone using the name Shan (Mountain). All of this info is public information at whois.com. So look up those websites you mention. It is highly unlikely they are all affiliated with Reddit or the guy who put up that 2007 blog you referred to. It is far more likely that the scammers they are all reporting are notorious cheaters especially when they overlap with other sites like Scamadviser.com, scamorg.com, scamalot.com, scamguard.com, realscam.com, scam detective.com etc.

When you have some concrete evidence and proof about your grand conspiracy I will be all ears John. In the meantime, I am just grateful that previous scam victims are decent and considerate, and unselfish enough to warn the rest of us to watch out for the same shit they stepped in.

I keep noticing that in all your advice given to newbies, most of which I agree with except the part about using recruiters, you keep pushing recruiters. Can you publish a list of who YOU believe are reputable recruiters for China? I personally only used 1 recruiter to get my first China gig and that experience cost me $20,000 in lost income. So for the last 8 years I have been finding my own jobs and have no difficulty to do so and have abosulety no qualms ore reservations to tell the newbies STAY FAR AWAY FROM RECRUITERS BECAUSE 90% OF THEM ARE DISHONEST AND WILL CHEAT, SKIM, AND SCAM YOU!
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

'With that I’ve had my say and realise that the more I post about this, the more it gives you lot an opportunity to include further spam links.'
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Murphy
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Murphy »

Okay John, I amicably agree to disagree with you and maintain that anyone coming to visit, live, or work in China needs to be keenly aware that ALL foreigners are targets of many China scam artists especially expats that work in China. I do not have a website as my signature line so I will just leave this last link for the benefit of anyone planning on coming to China... https://www.scam.com/showthread.php?704 ... -BLACKLIST Stay well John and give Mongolia my best regards. I really miss the beef and milk candy from there!
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Cricket »

Image

As I just finished explaining to you in another post John, all foreign teachers teaching around the globe, and especially the newbies in China have a right to be warned of the dozens of scammers that are targeting them for many different clever frauds that can not only be costly, but can leave an expat stranded and broke over a thousand miles from home. I guess you never read the story of teacher Cox about 6 years ago when Rebecca from China ESL skimmed 60% of her salary? Here is the horrible contract that let it happen. https://www.reddit.com/r/TeflReviews/co ... gn_hr_aka/ That same Rebecca got over 1,200 foreign teachers arrested and deported by letting them work with out a Z visa and even selling them fake university degrees and phony TEFL certificates, and even bogus police certificates!

Tell me honestly John, You would not want to warn the newbies about these scams and just let them get ripped off? You admitted that you avoid the scams by working for public schools. GOOD FOR YOU! Here is what happened in 2016, and 2017 to teachers who happened to fall into some of the many TEFL job scams https://youtu.be/9mW9l0-ZdO0
It was in every China newspaper and on CCTV and BTV news. I only got scammed once - but never again because my wife subscribed to the CFTU and CTA newsletters that warned us what to look out for. I am grateful that we had warnings that the above people obviously did not.

If there were not so many TEFL scams there would not be so many people posting warnings on 23 different scam warning sites (may be more or less by now) Once again I respect your opinion John, but I still feel an obligation as a Christian and a human being to help people avoid unpleasant experiences. Just one scam can mean the difference between a teacher have a great dream job in China or a nightmare that will taint their view about China as long as they live. These below links are NOT CFTU links John. They are links posted by other teachers, and I publicly thank them here and now for CARING ABOUT OTHERS!


https://reddit.com/r/teflscams

https://ruqqus.com/+TEFLblacklist

https://chinascampatrol.wordpress.com


BTW... Joe himself was the first one to acknowledge the real risks and dangers of TEFL scams when he himself started the very first Scam Warning Thread of all the TEFL forums that people have used for years, including myself. Not even ESLCafe did what Joe did. The owner of TEFL.net was the pioneer of warning TEFL teachers for which he is not only applauded, but respected. Because he showed a sincere concern for us, people trust TEFL.net, and we believe and trust the advice we find here John. .viewtopic.php?f=16&t=4528
Last edited by Cricket on 04 Feb 2021, 20:55, edited 2 times in total.
Before sending off your resume or passport scan, be sure to check https://reddit.com/r/teflscams and to vaccinate yourself against foreign teacher job scams.
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Vagabond
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Status: Teacher Trainer

Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Vagabond »

You guys keep arguing all you want. For me I don't use job agents any more and get my own gigs now and my pay has doubled. But when I did use recruiters and job agents in the past, I also used just one link which is a list of 7 questions to always ask. If they could not answer the 7 questions I just hung up the phone https://www.realscam.com/f51/fraud-warn ... live-4799/

No, I will never work foe the peanuts paid by China's public school system. I didn't travel 4,500 miles to China to struggle to make ends meet. I like my steak and beer and night out with my friends and don't want to live with three roommates Thank you. I now earn over 20,000 rmb after taxes and my only roommate is my partner. We have satellite TV with 210 English channels, and take Chinese lessons once a week. I negotiated my free furnished apartment because I was willing to sign a two year contract - only because this training center was highly rated by other teachers and is registered with SAFEA and has a SAIC business license.

I have a safe and secure job only because I used both white and blacklists that are always posted at reddit.com/r/tefl_tips_traps_scams. My lifestyle is comfortable and I am never short of money, beer, nor fun. On my two days off, I jump on my motorcycle or a train and go visit another city or go fishing or horseback riding in the countryside or hike and camp on the Great Wall. If it were not for those "scam links" I would not have such a good life right now and would always be stressed out about money. To each his own mate.
Before taking any teaching job in China make a quick visit over to https://reddit.com/r/ChinaScamCentral and https://reddit.com/r/TEFLreviews so your dream job does not become a nightmare.
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John V55
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Joined: 02 Apr 2015, 01:34
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

You know who you are. Keep those link farm site links flowing?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Link_farm

A polite warning. If I find this post is losing Google authority because of its external spam links, I’ll rewrite the content as an article and put it on a very authoritative site that you’re unable to comment on and link your spam sites out of. :)
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Cricket
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Cricket »

Image

I'm sorry John, but you now just convinced me that you must be using this forum to recruit newbies because you get all upset every time someone tells them they can earn more money SAFELY without having to settle for the low pay of public schools which YOU keep promoting. And as I mentioned before, you have been promoting yourself with your resume in over 200 posts and counting. Most people would consider this to be spamming.

I myself once taught at public high school at Beijing No. 19 in Haidian, and I could not wait for my contract to end as I was always counting my money and hoping I had enough left to eat by the end of the month! And yes, I too love Mongolia (in the summertime!) but every TEFL teacher deserves to know the truth about the REAL salaries of TEFL teachers in China and not just what recruiters and job agents want them to think John. This is an international link and has nothing to do with your beloved CFTU, the CTA, or China Scam Watch groups. http://www.salaryexplorer.com/salary-su ... &jobtype=1 Are these people a scam too John? Anyone who doesn't agree with you seems to somehow be connected to the CFTU in your opinion.

You know John, you are getting like those bully moderators over at eslcafe who have no tolerance for people that make honest statements that they can back up, or who simply disagree. If you cannot tolerate opposing points of view, people will end up looking for another forum where they can speak freely. I mean, now you even threaten people. One last time... I AGREE WITH YOU ABOUT THE ABSOLUTE SAFETY AND LEGITIMACY OF PUBLIC SCHOOLS AND UNIVERSITIES IN CHINA - BUT TEFL and AP/IB/Subject/Art Teachers can earn two or even three times more money SAFELY in a Tier 1 city and even get free housing IF they do a little homework and investigating. THIS IS A FACT WHETHER YOU WANT TO ADMIT IT OR NOT JOHN.

Why do you want people to believe they are "Greedy" for wanting the best pay package they can get? Only dumb, ignorant, or UNQUALIFIED teachers want to earn less - not more. Ambition is NOT greed John. Young teachers should reach for that brass ring so they do not retire with regrets. The TEFL job market has RISKS that we need not discuss yet again. BUT - THESE RISKS ARE MANAGEABLE WITH SOME BASIC DUE DILIGENCE. John is against Scam Warning Links and I am for them so long as it is not some disgruntled teacher who got fired for legitimate reasons. But when 10-20 teachers complain about the same school, recruiter, or Principal. I take those warnings seriously. As I said in my other post. I no longer need to pay attention to those "scam links" because I now do private tutoring and only get part time jobs with White-Listed employers (Those that are registered with SAFEA and have a SAIC business license) until my own WOFE is approved and I get my own business license. My employment today is just as safe as any public school. Most of all it was my choice and no recruiter or job agent tried to trap me in one of their trick bags.

Maybe these higher paying schools turned you down because of your age, and now this is a case of Sour Grapes? For the rest of you Chinese employers generally like young teachers with blonde hair and blue eyes and are silently racist towards people of color (Blacks, Indians, Latinos) But fortunately schools like Hampson and Morgan will always hire ANY native speaker with a real diploma. And once you are over 50 years of age only universities want to hire you. Ask anyone who worked more than 5 years in China and who is not moon-lighting as a recruiter for extra cash, and they will tell you, these are the facts, not rumors, nor opinions.
Before sending off your resume or passport scan, be sure to check https://reddit.com/r/teflscams and to vaccinate yourself against foreign teacher job scams.
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John V55
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by John V55 »

I feel no need to be drawn into defending myself as I only link out to my own work and reputable sites and have no single agenda. You can’t trash my reputation, because I’m independent, not a recruiter or affiliated with any organization. But I know who’s behind you. ;)

Fair enough, I will now go and spend time writing a full blown essay on TEFL and scams which will include warnings about the organization behind you and the link farm spam sites you’re linking out to which I will then distribute around my own preferred high authority sites. No hard feelings anonymous Cricket. I don’t particularly care and I suspect neither do you, but I’ll bet the organization you’re spamming for won’t be pleased. Good luck and take care. :)
Before following CFTU click baits take a quick look at https://www.opnlttr.com/letter/china-fo ... scammed-me
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Atlas
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Re: The truth behind scam links

Unread post by Atlas »

I ain't taking sides here but what makes you think someone who posts links to support what they say is representing someone other than themselves? You both made valid points about working safely and avoiding scams but each of you uses different ways to accomplish the same goal. Mr. John prefers to sacrifice the extra income to work inside the protective moat of public schools. Mr Cricket prefers the higher income and made his way through the minefield using the warnings of others. You both succeeded. Kudos to both of you. In my judgement there is always more than one way to skin a cat as my grandpa always told me.

I don't see anything wrong with posting external links (so long as they relate to the subject debated and not some sort of advertising) and I don't see anything wrong with a user putting his resume in his online signature. I also suggest that if some mystery organization had something important to say, they would just open a user account like the rest of us and post away. Doesn''t that make sense to you Mr. John? I don't see Mr. Cricket promoting anyone here nor any group trying to recruit anyone as you implied in your older post. Where do you see that happening? Likewise Mr. Cricket I don't see Mr. John asking users to contact him for work or referrals or giving an email address where to send resumes. Can you prove he is recruiting newbies with PMs? I do not see any conspiracy or hidden agendas here, and everyone who reads this thread will surely know the dangers and risks of being cheated as a foreign teacher in China, thanks to you two an Murphy. Why can't we just respect one another as people trying to help and guide others away from the many crooks that want to make money from all of us at any cost?
Look Before You Leap at https://reddit.com/r/teflscams
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