A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

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daxey
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A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 04 Dec 2016, 13:54

Hello there,

In the beginning, I'd like to introduce myself and briefly describe myself. My name is Dawid, I will turn 21 in January.
I am a European (Polish) and I live in the UK. I attend the college over here (NVQ Lvl 3 in Mechanical Engineering) and also I am going to start the university (The Open University) to get a bachelor degree. I've chosen the English and Literature major.

So much for the introduction. I have a couple of questions for the future. Firstly, have I chosen a right major in order to find a job overseas (particularly I mean in South-Eastern Asia, because I am really fascinated about this region).

I've been hesitating between the Education major and the English language & literature. Finally, I've made the decision to pick up the second one. What are your thoughts about my choice?

Secondly, will I even have any real, I am marking out a word real chances to find a job in countries like Korea, Taiwan, Japan, China, Vietnam, Thailand etc with the BA in English from a British University and let's say a PGCE / TEFL / CELTA certification?

Thirdly, what are your expectations of the job market in Asia in let's say 3-5 years? In your opinion will there still be a demand for foreign English teachers (not necessarily native)?

Fourthly, do the fact that I'll possibly have a chance (maybe in few yeas) obtain the UK citizenship and passport enhance my value in any way (I guess that it does, but I'd like to know the opinion of an experienced people in the business).

Fifthly thank you for reading this abundant and long post I hope that you will help me to direct my career and reach my dreams of Asia.

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by Briona » 05 Dec 2016, 09:42

Hi Dawid,

Welcome to the forum.
daxey wrote:I've been hesitating between the Education major and the English language & literature. Finally, I've made the decision to pick up the second one. What are your thoughts about my choice?
To teach in Asia, you need to have a Bachelor's degree. As it's to satisfy visa conditions, it doesn't matter what it's in (for the time being, at least). That said, degrees in education or English will always be looked upon favourably. My advice would be choose whichever one you're more interested in.
daxey wrote:Secondly, will I even have any real, I am marking out a word real chances to find a job in countries like Korea, Taiwan, Japan, China, Vietnam, Thailand etc with the BA in English from a British University and let's say a PGCE / TEFL / CELTA certification?
I'm afraid Japan is not an option for you, as to teach there you need to have completed 12 years of primary and high school education in a native English-speaking country. So even if you could get a British passport, you wouldn't qualify to work there. I'm not sure about Korea - it might be the same as Japan. However, all of the other countries should be an option. Bear in mind though that visa rules change from year to year so you will need to do more research closer to the time.

When I started teaching seven years ago, I worked in Vietnam, and many of my colleagues were non-native English-speakers. It's a similar story in China and, I believe, in Thailand. There are definitely jobs out there for the determined.
daxey wrote:Thirdly, what are your expectations of the job market in Asia in let's say 3-5 years? In your opinion will there still be a demand for foreign English teachers (not necessarily native)?
I think there will be a demand for English teachers for some years to come. However, given how rapidly the market changes, it's not possible to say where exactly these jobs will be, or what visa requirements will be. In the seven years I've been teaching, markets have grown and markets have shrunk, visa regulations have been tightened and moves have been made to employ local rather than foreign teachers.

No-one can say what the future will bring... But I would say you'll never regret investing in a degree (it's pretty much a requirement to teach in Poland anyway, which you might want to do in the future), so go for it and re-assess the situation nearer the time.
daxey wrote:Fourthly, do the fact that I'll possibly have a chance (maybe in few yeas) obtain the UK citizenship and passport enhance my value in any way (I guess that it does, but I'd like to know the opinion of an experienced people in the business).
As I mentioned above, having British citizenship will not make a difference to countries like Japan who require you to have been educated in that country. Furthermore, we have yet to see what the fallout from Brexit will do to the strength and value of the British passport - you may find you're better off on a Polish passport (and I say that as a British citizen!).

Hope that helps, and if you have any other questions, please ask.

Briona
Experience teaching in Vietnam, Portugal, Poland, Spain, the UK, and Qatar

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John V55
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by John V55 » 06 Dec 2016, 11:33

Hi Dawid (sounds Welsh? :D ),

First: Unless you’re a (NES) native English speaker (British passport), that’s going to be a problem, no matter what your academic qualifications.

Second: A degree in anything is a necessity, but if you can do a PGCE after that, hopefully it will mitigate against not being a NES. TEFL is a bonus, but doesn’t make up for not being a native speaker.

Third: If you can get a British passport that would be a lifesaver. You’ll see many ads for NES, or from a list of English speaking countries, that’s why a passport from these countries is so important.

Fourth: Education or English literature? I’d go for education if you’re looking to get into teaching and it will help you with the follow up PGCE if you choose that route.

If you’re at the stage of starting a degree, it’s going to be several years yet before you’ll get anywhere and as Briona says, things change, but at the moment yes, a British passport, a degree and TEFL gets you into places like Thailand and Cambodia. Once there, a couple of years’ experience and you can take your pick of anywhere in Asia. A PGCE gets you into the top end, with a salary to match.

P.S Thailand is nice to live in, but the salary is generally low and the hours gruelling.
China pays well, but the culture takes some getting used to.
Teaching isn’t exotic, it’s hard work, but I guess you’ve had enough of the UK, as I did. :D
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daxey
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 09 Dec 2016, 15:26

Briona wrote:Hi Dawid,

Welcome to the forum.

I'm afraid Japan is not an option for you, as to teach there you need to have completed 12 years of primary and high school education in a native English-speaking country. So even if you could get a British passport, you wouldn't qualify to work there. I'm not sure about Korea - it might be the same as Japan. However, all of the other countries should be an option. Bear in mind though that visa rules change from year to year so you will need to do more research closer to the time.
I've been seeking out the teaching jobs announcements throughout Japan and mostly they specify the English required level as a native, which may be interpreted doubly. Of course they prefer a native person, though I think that probably - if I would be able to achieve the native level of English also an accent (many people I work with in Britain claim that I speak like a local, though that's hard for me to verify the truth value of these reviews, because Brits are very polite and maybe they just say so out of politeness =) ).
I realise that, particularly grammatically I am not fully correct though I am trying to get better.

By the way, what do you honestly think about my current command of English. I know that's difficult to judge based on a short conversation on the forum, though I've typed pretty long posts. What would you recommend to focus on the most, I think the grammar but like what, more specific. Any recommendations will be highly appreciated, cheers.

About Korea I think that they require just a passport, because I've seen many of the offers where they are looking for a UK, USA, Aussie etc. passport holder.
Briona wrote: When I started teaching seven years ago, I worked in Vietnam, and many of my colleagues were non-native English-speakers. It's a similar story in China and, I believe, in Thailand. There are definitely jobs out there for the determined.
I've been always dreaming of Japan, though Korea, Vietnam, Taiwan, Thailand and China are very attractive to me also.
Briona wrote: No-one can say what the future will bring... But I would say you'll never regret investing in a degree (it's pretty much a requirement to teach in Poland anyway, which you might want to do in the future), so go for it and re-assess the situation nearer the time.

As I mentioned above, having British citizenship will not make a difference to countries like Japan who require you to have been educated in that country. Furthermore, we have yet to see what the fallout from Brexit will do to the strength and value of the British passport - you may find you're better off on a Polish passport (and I say that as a British citizen!).
Yes I agree that a degree from the UK university will for sure be valuable anyways, personally I doubt I'd like to teach in Poland because I want to explore the world, which is probably a motivation of the most of the TEFL-ers. I think that there are a lot of possibilities all around the world, because all of the (or the vast majority) of non-English speaking people want to learn this language and actually I think that the natives could not cover all of the demand over the world, because of the proportion.

Briefly about the Brexit - in my opinion the whole process will be extended anyways and an official breakaway of the UK from the European Union may take longer than we all are thinking and also I think that the political and economical results might be also better than many Euro-enthusiasts assume, because in fact the UK as one of the most powerful countries in the Union used to be rather a giver. Of course the time shall show, but I think that the UK will be fine just like Norway or Switzerland (the richest countries in Europe and also one of the richest in the world), which are not the members of the European Union.

The last thing is that passport thing, obviously I can not change or influence on the place I was born in, though I think that a citizenship may be a good way to prove that I've adapted into the English culture et cetera and possibly this will be a good advantage in terms of obtaining a visa or a general value on the market. I can ensure you that the British citizenship will be way more valuable than Polish unless some new political options with a fresh, healthily and better views will get to the power. Then, possibly we could be talking about a competition, for the upcoming years we can not. I am interested in politics both, local and global and also like talking about such issues.

Thank you for your comprehensive answer and yes, that has certainly helped.
JohnV55 wrote: Hi Dawid (sounds Welsh? :D ),
Oh Welsh language seems so complex, haha. Dawid is an Hebrew name, though it's pretty popular and common in Poland. :D
JohnV55 wrote:PGCE gets you into the top end, with a salary to match.
So a PGCE is that valuable? I think that most of the teachers abroad don't hold this.
JohnV55 wrote:Thailand is nice to live in, but the salary is generally low and the hours gruelling.
Yes I think so, thought as well the living costs are low, so I think I'll be fine. :D

Thank you for your reply also and I am also curious about your opinion about my command of English,
By the way, what do you honestly think about my current command of English. I know that's difficult to judge based on a short conversation on the forum, though I've typed pretty long posts. What would you recommend to focus on the most, I think the grammar but like what, more specific. Any recommendations will be highly appreciated, cheers.
Have a nice weekend guys,
Dawid

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John V55
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by John V55 » 10 Dec 2016, 10:27

@Dawid.

Yes, it’s true that most TEFLers don’t hold a PGCE, the salary increase is why they wish they did. For some, it’s not worth the trouble of returning to do it, for others like myself, I’m too old.Yet if I were twenty years younger . . . A PGCE isn’t just valuable, it’s a goldmine to teaching anywhere in the world.

The reason that most recruiters ask for NES is exactly that, grammar. Unless you’re born into it, or bilingual from a very early age, a NES will always pick up on it. Yes, I picked some up already, which doesn’t mean you can’t write in English, but I immediately spotted the small mistakes and the Americanisms, which sound strange from someone Polish, living in England. Most recruiters do online Skype interviews, so focus on speech, pronunciation, speak slowly and clearly.

There is still, despite the recession, a huge demand for English teachers which NES can’t satisfy. So yes, there will always be opportunities, but the salary will reflect the difference between non-NES and TEFL v PGCE. http://www.seriousteachers.com/index/0//0 is where a lot of us go to browse international vacancies, check out the general requirements and opportunities and have a look at my signature link.

No one ever got rich from TEFL, but it’s a good life, in general. You get to see the parts of the world you want to and get paid for it, plus the new experiences away from the recession devastated Europe (which in a post-industrial west probably isn’t going to get better). I’d recommend it. :)
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 10 Dec 2016, 23:49

John V55 wrote:@Dawid.

Yes, it’s true that most TEFLers don’t hold a PGCE, the salary increase is why they wish they did. For some, it’s not worth the trouble of returning to do it, for others like myself, I’m too old.Yet if I were twenty years younger . . . A PGCE isn’t just valuable, it’s a goldmine to teaching anywhere in the world.
Sounds great actually, but most of the employers require and ask for a CELTA of a TEFL. Do they even bother about PGCE actually? A goldmine sounds like good a good advantage for a NNES on the market.
John V55 wrote: The reason that most recruiters ask for NES is exactly that, grammar. Unless you’re born into it, or bilingual from a very early age, a NES will always pick up on it. Yes, I picked some up already, which doesn’t mean you can’t write in English, but I immediately spotted the small mistakes and the Americanisms, which sound strange from someone Polish, living in England. Most recruiters do online Skype interviews, so focus on speech, pronunciation, speak slowly and clearly.
Could you give me some, specific examples of these mistakes and 'Americanisms' (I guess that most of the social medias and a comprehensive Internet is highly Americanised and influenced on most of the NNES, though I've been living in the UK for not even 6 months (17th of Dec will be exactly a half of a year since I've turned up over here) so I think I've not adapted that much British-English comparing to American-English I've been systematically assimilating whilst surfing the net. I know for example the difference of an American cookie and a British biscuit, though I know both of those forms a cookie is the first one which turns up on my mind, though lately some of my co-workers has treated me with some BISCUITS so I think I will Brtishing myself over time. :D
John V55 wrote: There is still, despite the recession, a huge demand for English teachers which NES can’t satisfy. So yes, there will always be opportunities, but the salary will reflect the difference between non-NES and TEFL v PGCE. http://www.seriousteachers.com/index/0//0 is where a lot of us go to browse international vacancies, check out the general requirements and opportunities and have a look at my signature link.

No one ever got rich from TEFL, but it’s a good life, in general. You get to see the parts of the world you want to and get paid for it, plus the new experiences away from the recession devastated Europe (which in a post-industrial west probably isn’t going to get better). I’d recommend it. :)
My the biggest motivation to become a TEFL teacher is obviously the desire to explore the world, particularly Asia - where I've always wanted to live and settle down. Aside of that I am not a kind of handyman (ironically I work as an apprentice design engineer, though that's mostly related to operating the PC so I think that's why I am doing not so bad), so I've always considered myself as a person who will be earning by talking (lawyer, politician - lol) or by teaching et cetera, so I basically I sure that I'd be happy, though I like the UK also very much - much more opportunities (for example the apprenticeships, something we could dream about in Poland, really), the cozy, comfy houses and terraces and in general, very polite people.

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by Briona » 11 Dec 2016, 11:58

Hi Dawid,
daxey wrote:
John V55 wrote:@Dawid. Yes, it’s true that most TEFLers don’t hold a PGCE, the salary increase is why they wish they did. For some, it’s not worth the trouble of returning to do it, for others like myself, I’m too old.Yet if I were twenty years younger . . . A PGCE isn’t just valuable, it’s a goldmine to teaching anywhere in the world.
Sounds great actually, but most of the employers require and ask for a CELTA of a TEFL. Do they even bother about PGCE actually? A goldmine sounds like good a good advantage for a NNES on the market.
A TEFL certificate, such as the CELTA or Trinity CertTESOL, and a PGCE serve different purposes. If you'd like to teach English as a Foreign Language (EFL), you need a TEFL certificate. If, however, you'd like to teach a subject in a primary/secondary school, you need the PGCE. It's worth noting that most international schools, i.e., schools which teach the British/American national curriculum, require you to have a minimum of two years' post-qualification experience in your home country/country of residence. So, in addition to finishing your current degree, you'd need a year for the PGCE, a further year to get QTS (Qualified Teacher Status) and then two more years to get the experience.

To sum up, TEFL requires fewer qualifications and no real experience. The downside is that wages are lower than those of qualified primary/secondary teachers, holidays are frequently unpaid, and there's less opportunity for career progression. So my advice would be to think long-term - where do you see yourself in the future? If it's still in teaching, I'd definitely advise getting a PGCE.
daxey wrote: By the way, what do you honestly think about my current command of English. I know that's difficult to judge based on a short conversation on the forum, though I've typed pretty long posts. What would you recommend to focus on the most, I think the grammar but like what, more specific. Any recommendations will be highly appreciated, cheers.
You've mentioned your grammar a few times, but actually it's pretty good. The more pressing issues are actually with vocabulary.

For example, in your first post, you used the expression "in the beginning", which means "At first" and is used to introduce a contrast rather than to start a presentation. Compare: "In the beginning, I couldn't speak English well [but now I can]" with "To start/begin with, I'd like to introduce myself".

In the same post, you use the expression "So much for". While you have used it correctly, you've chosen the less common usage. We usually use it to say that something has not been successful or useful! For example, "so much for that idea", meaning that it was a waste of time.

Throughout your posts, there are several other odd/incorrect uses of vocabulary/phrases. However, I must stress that none of these hinder understanding in any way. I'm merely highlighting them as a suggestion for what to work on. You have a pretty good command of the English language, which will stand you in good stead for the future.

Hope that helps, and if you have any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

Briona
Experience teaching in Vietnam, Portugal, Poland, Spain, the UK, and Qatar

daxey
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 11 Dec 2016, 22:04

Briona wrote:Hi Dawid,

A TEFL certificate, such as the CELTA or Trinity CertTESOL, and a PGCE serve different purposes. If you'd like to teach English as a Foreign Language (EFL), you need a TEFL certificate. If, however, you'd like to teach a subject in a primary/secondary school, you need the PGCE. It's worth noting that most international schools, i.e., schools which teach the British/American national curriculum, require you to have a minimum of two years' post-qualification experience in your home country/country of residence. So, in addition to finishing your current degree, you'd need a year for the PGCE, a further year to get QTS (Qualified Teacher Status) and then two more years to get the experience.

To sum up, TEFL requires fewer qualifications and no real experience. The downside is that wages are lower than those of qualified primary/secondary teachers, holidays are frequently unpaid, and there's less opportunity for career progression. So my advice would be to think long-term - where do you see yourself in the future? If it's still in teaching, I'd definitely advise getting a PGCE.
Hi Briona,
I see. The required experience upon finishing a PGCE is a bit tricky, because of extra two years of experience in the UK (if I even would be eligible to find a job as a non-British. Teaching English to native English people by non-native speaker might seem a little bit less efficient, though maybe that's just my personal NNES apprehension.

I'd like to present my plan to you. I'd like to get an honorous degree in the English language and literature, I expect this to be finished in 2020/2021 (January) so at that time I will be in the UK already for about 4 and half years (since June 2016, according to the present law I need to be over here for at least 5 years + about 6-12 months is the application procedure for the citizenship, over these 5 years I can not be out of the UK for more than 450 days (90 over the last, 5th year)), afterwards, I'd like to do a gap year abroad/some internships (though there is a really sad thing for me, because most of the TEFL internships abroad in Asia require a native-speaker/passport holder, I've checked few websites with internships in Vietnam, Thailand etc, but they accept only natives, which is pretty sad cuz the programs are paid anyways - you need to pay for participation and I'd, but without passport (I would rather not have yet) I can not jump in.

I'd like to do my TEFL/CELTA (which one is better, though, I've seen that many people recommend the CELTA as a more valuable one, what's the difference? Is CELTA more for NA and TEFL for Europeans?) during an internship, but I doubt I'll be eligible for any anyways, so maybe just a certification will be fair enough somewhere abroad in Asia and after receiving my TEFL/CELTA I'd start my job-hunting to get a first job which may be probably a tricky task. Well, eventually, could do a volunteering to gain some experience. Then after a year or someday I could go back to the UK and try to obtain the citizenship, maybe find any teaching job in here also/contact any agency that is specialised in finding the job placements abroad or (if I'd be fine upon finishing my TEFL just stay over there).
Briona wrote: For example, in your first post, you used the expression "in the beginning", which means "At first" and is used to introduce a contrast rather than to start presentation. Compare: "In the beginning, I couldn't speak English well [but now I can]" with "To start/begin with, I'd like to introduce myself".

In the same post, you use the expression "So much for". While you have used it correctly, you've chosen the less common usage. We usually use it to say that something has not been successful or useful! For example, "so much for that idea", meaning that it was a waste of time.

Throughout your posts, there are several other odd/incorrect uses of vocabulary/phrases. However, I must stress that none of these hinder understanding in any way. I'm merely highlighting them as a suggestion for what to work on. You have a pretty good command of the English language, which will stand you in good stead for the future.

Hope that helps, and if you have any other questions, please don't hesitate to ask.

Briona
Thank you very much mate for marking those out - the devil’s in the detail. Any amendments are highly appreicated mate.

Have a nice week!

Sincerely,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by Briona » 11 Dec 2016, 23:51

Hi again,
daxey wrote:I see. The required experience upon finishing a PGCE is a bit tricky, because of extra two years of experience in the UK (if I even would be eligible to find a job as a non-British. Teaching English to native English people by non-native speaker might seem a little bit less efficient, though maybe that's just my personal NNES apprehension.
While you must have a near-native command of the English language, there are no nationality requirements to teach in British schools. There is no reason, therefore, why you wouldn't be able to find work. Indeed, schools with a high proportion of Polish kids might appreciate having a teacher who could, if necessary, speak to them in their native language.
daxey wrote:I'd like to present my plan to you. I'd like to get an honorous degree in the English language and literature, I expect this to be finished in 2020/2021 (January) so at that time I will be in the UK already for about 4 and half years (since June 2016, according to the present law I need to be over here for at least 5 years + about 6-12 months is the application procedure for the citizenship, over these 5 years I can not be out of the UK for more than 450 days (90 over the last, 5th year)).
If you entered the UK before June 2016, you qualify under whatever the previous rules were. In any case, your five years counts from the day you entered the UK as long as you were (a) employed (or a genuine jobseeker) or (b) a student.
daxey wrote:...afterwards, I'd like to do a gap year abroad/some internships (though there is a really sad thing for me, because most of the TEFL internships abroad in Asia require a native-speaker/passport holder, I've checked few websites with internships in Vietnam, Thailand etc, but they accept only natives, which is pretty sad cuz the programs are paid anyways - you need to pay for participation and I'd, but without passport (I would rather not have yet) I can not jump in.
I'll be honest with you: internships are a waste of time. Not only do they pay your peanuts for doing the same work as actual employees, but in many cases you pay them for the "privilege". Furthermore, many of these so-called internships fail to secure the correct visa for you, meaning that you end up working illegally, thereby jeopardising your chances of finding legal work in that country or even region. Avoid at all costs!
daxey wrote:I'd like to do my TEFL/CELTA (which one is better, though, I've seen that many people recommend the CELTA as a more valuable one, what's the difference? Is CELTA more for NA and TEFL for Europeans?) during an internship, but I doubt I'll be eligible for any anyways, so maybe just a certification will be fair enough somewhere abroad in Asia and after receiving my TEFL/CELTA I'd start my job-hunting to get a first job which may be probably a tricky task.
Contrary to popular opinion, TEFL is not actually a course - it's simply an acronym for the industry. The CELTA and Trinity CertTESOL are types of TEFL courses, and are the most internationally-recognised courses available. The difference between the CELTA and so-called "TEFL" courses lies in the teaching practice. On the CELTA and Trinity CertTESOL you teach actual students and are observed and assessed doing so. This is something that online/blended courses lack, even those with a "weekend/classroom-based element" (which involves "teaching" your fellow trainees). As a non-native English-speaker, I would highly recommend shelling out for one of the better courses, i.e., CELTA or Trinity CertTESOL. They cost around £1,000, but if teaching is what you want to do, they are one of the best investments you can make.
that is specialised in finding the job placements abroad or (if I'd be fine upon finishing my TEFL just stay over there).

In your situation, I would concentrate on getting the degree first. Then, I would complete the CELTA, perhaps in a country you'd like to work in. This would give limited experience with students from that country. Moreover, course providers tend to have links to local employers, which would make it easier to find work.

Hope that helps, and if you have any other questions, please ask.

Briona
Experience teaching in Vietnam, Portugal, Poland, Spain, the UK, and Qatar

daxey
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 12 Dec 2016, 12:07

Briona wrote:Hi again,
daxey wrote:I see. The required experience upon finishing a PGCE is a bit tricky, because of extra two years of experience in the UK (if I even would be eligible to find a job as a non-British. Teaching English to native English people by non-native speaker might seem a little bit less efficient, though maybe that's just my personal NNES apprehension.
While you must have a near-native command of the English language, there are no nationality requirements to teach in British schools. There is no reason, therefore, why you wouldn't be able to find work. Indeed, schools with a high proportion of Polish kids might appreciate having a teacher who could, if necessary, speak to them in their native language.

If you entered the UK before June 2016, you qualify under whatever the previous rules were. In any case, your five years counts from the day you entered the UK as long as you were (a) employed (or a genuine jobseeker) or (b) a student.
I've crossed the UK border on 17th of June (a week before the referendum) and straight away after I started to applying for the jobs and apprenticeships. I've attended quite a few interviews over a month and I found an employer that offered an apprenticeship to me (my very first day of work was on 18th of July). So yes I would say that I was a genuine jobseeker since 18th of June.
I shall begin my university in January the 29th (my birthday by the way :D).
Briona wrote: I'll be honest with you: internships are a waste of time. Not only do they pay your peanuts for doing the same work as actual employees, but in many cases you pay them for the "privilege". Furthermore, many of these so-called internships fail to secure the correct visa for you, meaning that you end up working illegally, thereby jeopardising your chances of finding legal work in that country or even region. Avoid at all costs!
Oh, thank you for this suggestion, because all of those internship usually costs over 1000 quids which is quite much. So would you rather advice me to use the money I'would have spent on internship to spend them for a living expenses in the country I will go to? The second thing is of course doing a CELTA in this country prior to job hunting. I think that in my situation I can not rather find a job remotely (maybe except China), because most of the adverts online seeking the NES only. I think I should use a local agencies (?) or at least be able to attend an interview in person. What do you think?
Briona wrote: In your situation, I would concentrate on getting the degree first. Then, I would complete the CELTA, perhaps in a country you'd like to work in. This would give limited experience with students from that country. Moreover, course providers tend to have links to local employers, which would make it easier to find work.

Hope that helps, and if you have any other questions, please ask.

Briona
Thank you again for those valuable hints and tips. I think that I will choose the CELTA over the TEFL.

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by John V55 » 13 Dec 2016, 11:51

@ Dawid,

Most ask for TEFL because they’re looking for TEFL teachers. You wouldn’t really be looking for basic TEFL with a PGCE, but international schools in places like Hong Kong and Singapore, or the Middle East. Basic TEFL is a degree, NES and TEFL certificate, but in your twenties, you should be aiming higher. Those who arrived in Asia ten years ago, when the only requirements were to be white and breathing, later regretted not having a degree; after all, you didn’t need one . . . then. Times change and in today’s world, the more qualifications that set you apart from the herd, the better. As an example, I’m white NES, that makes Asian employers interested. I have experience and a TEFL, that makes employers very interested. I have a Master’s, that makes employeres very, very interested. Do you see what I mean? A this stage don’t worry too much; concentrate on your degree, there’s plenty of time and it will all come together in the end.

You’ll pick up the nuances from whichever source you learned the language from. Not that American English is wrong, it’s still English, but when we read, we spot it straight away.
Yes I agree that a degree from the UK university will for sure be valuable anyways . . .
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 13 Dec 2016, 13:04

John V55 wrote:@ Dawid,

Most ask for TEFL because they’re looking for TEFL teachers. You wouldn’t really be looking for basic TEFL with a PGCE, but international schools in places like Hong Kong and Singapore, or the Middle East. Basic TEFL is a degree, NES and TEFL certificate, but in your twenties, you should be aiming higher. Those who arrived in Asia ten years ago, when the only requirements were to be white and breathing, later regretted not having a degree; after all, you didn’t need one . . . then. Times change and in today’s world, the more qualifications that set you apart from the herd, the better. As an example, I’m white NES, that makes Asian employers interested. I have experience and a TEFL, that makes employers very interested. I have a Master’s, that makes employeres very, very interested. Do you see what I mean? A this stage don’t worry too much; concentrate on your degree, there’s plenty of time and it will all come together in the end.

Hi John,
yes I bear in mind that the much qualifier I am, the bigger my chances are, but I don't know why, but I am afraid of the lessen opportunities/job vacancies in the future, that's why I'd like to get hired somewhere over when possible. Maybe my fear of the recession is exaggerated, because south-eastern and eastern Asia population is so big and still growing despite of the relative recession in few places.
As you have told, the expectations are growing, I am white also but I do not think that is any value anymore (though many adverts asks for the pictures). I just want to play out this the best as possible that's why I am thinking years ahead. Maybe I am overthinking and over-stressing about this though.
John V55 wrote: You’ll pick up the nuances from whichever source you learned the language from. Not that American English is wrong, it’s still English, but when we read, we spot it straight away.
Yes I agree that a degree from the UK university will for sure be valuable anyways . . .
Oh yes, certainly the NES can.
About the marked out bit, will be valuable for sure would be a correct form? I've typed it in hurry, so probably that's just a typo, but I bear in mind that there's still a long way through the English language to 'master' it.

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by John V55 » 14 Dec 2016, 00:51

@Dawid,

While English remains the business language of the world, there will always remain opportunities. My point is that even if the market eventually constricts, the availability will then go to those with the highest qualifications. The East is fast replacing the west and places like Hong Kong, or Singapore, are now as advanced as any major European locations.

‘White’ is very important, it’s why they’re asking for photos and they’re almost compulsory on resumes. Asia is not politically correct and appearance often matters more than actual qualifications.

Yes I agree that a degree from the UK university will for sure be valuable anyways . . .
Yes, I agree that a degree from a UK university would be valuable, would sound like the correct British form. For sure and anyways would be the American form.

Don’t worry so much :) Asia is still recruiting after decades and China is absolutely desperate. After five years, my company alone is still looking for 80 teachers and simply can’t get them! As I said, concentrate on the degree first and leave the worrying till later. :)
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 14 Dec 2016, 12:10

John V55 wrote:@Dawid,

While English remains the business language of the world, there will always remain opportunities. My point is that even if the market eventually constricts, the availability will then go to those with the highest qualifications. The East is fast replacing the west and places like Hong Kong, or Singapore, are now as advanced as any major European locations.
Yeah I bear in mind that the East actually has actually exceed the west on many planes already and the near future seems to remains as it is.
John V55 wrote: ‘White’ is very important, it’s why they’re asking for photos and they’re almost compulsory on resumes. Asia is not politically correct and appearance often matters more than actual qualifications.
That is a big advantage I guess, being not a politically correct, because the political correctness is a bacteria that leads to much of bad and irrational situations throughout the EU (mostly in countries like Sweden), related to for example sexual abusing of women by 'refugees'. They often are not even punished afterwards, moreover some of them have received financial compensation for stay in custody(!) after raping a Swedish woman.
In this case though (favouring whites) that may be considered as a bit racism by other races, though I've seen some black working as a teacher so I'd not exaggerate about this issue.
Do you think that the "white-mania" will remain forever though? I think that most of Asian societies favouring white people because they mostly associate our race with high-development and basically with English language, well - the English language has been firstly using by Anglo-Saxons, your ancestors I suppose. so by white people.

Yes I agree that a degree from the UK university will for sure be valuable anyways . . .
Yes, I agree that a degree from a UK university would be valuable, would sound like the correct British form. For sure and anyways would be the American form.
[/quote]
I tend to use anyways, for sure (lately I've been trying to replace it with 'certainly'. I am trying to put my best foot forward to surround myself with the English language.
John V55 wrote: Don’t worry so much :) Asia is still recruiting after decades and China is absolutely desperate. After five years, my company alone is still looking for 80 teachers and simply can’t get them! As I said, concentrate on the degree first and leave the worrying till later. :)
Thank you for a warm words, I will do my best to stick to your suggestions.

Also, talking about the degree, I am still thinking if the English language and literature is the best one (I've already applied for), because I've seen many ads that say about the Education major as an advantage, though I think - perspectively the English language and literature might be better one, because this one opens up more doors.

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 20 Dec 2016, 14:46

Hi, sorry for a double post.

I'd like also to ask about some practical hints about a job seeking, I know that online, but maybe you know some specific portals, because most of the offers I have found are dedicated to the NES solely (required a native speaker etc).

Merry Christmas by the way :)

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by John V55 » 25 Dec 2016, 12:01

daxey wrote:Hi, sorry for a double post.

I'd like also to ask about some practical hints about a job seeking, I know that online, but maybe you know some specific portals, because most of the offers I have found are dedicated to the NES solely (required a native speaker etc).

Merry Christmas by the way :)
That is always going to be your problem – NES. State schools are generally not going to employ you, but private schools will. It’s a sort of process; you start with private and rely on word of mouth recommendations to progress. That’s why I think you should concentrate on educational achievements to make up for the lack of NES. It’s early days yet, but as you start to get to the end of your degree, start to write articles and publish them online, produce a WOW! resume and leave it lying around the internet for recruiters to find . . . Don’t worry, they will find you.
Merry Christmas to you too. :)
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 25 Dec 2016, 15:51

John V55 wrote:
daxey wrote:Hi, sorry for a double post.

I'd like also to ask about some practical hints about a job seeking, I know that online, but maybe you know some specific portals, because most of the offers I have found are dedicated to the NES solely (required a native speaker etc).

Merry Christmas by the way :)
That is always going to be your problem – NES. State schools are generally not going to employ you, but private schools will. It’s a sort of process; you start with private and rely on word of mouth recommendations to progress. That’s why I think you should concentrate on educational achievements to make up for the lack of NES. It’s early days yet, but as you start to get to the end of your degree, start to write articles and publish them online, produce a WOW! resume and leave it lying around the internet for recruiters to find . . . Don’t worry, they will find you.
Merry Christmas to you too. :)
Hi again, I am sorry for being so wordy and problematic, but I do not have any people in my enviornment who I could be talking about this with.

I have also posted a question on Dave's ESL cafe and some people told me that probably without the Education degree as a NNES I probably would not be able to get anything valuable, which makes me a little bit confused right now.

I have applied for the English language and literature at The Open University, I have been hesitating between these three majors:
http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifications/q89 - Early Childhood
http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifications/q23 - Childhood and Youth
http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifications/q39 - major I have chosen (English language and literature)

I think that there is still possibility to change major I have applied for.
Which one would be the best then in your opinion?

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 25 Dec 2016, 15:52

Sorry for a double post, but I could not attach more than 3 URL's in a single one.
http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifications/q94 - Education Studies (Primary)

Also I have found an interesting offer which probably would enhance my value significantly, namely a PGCE/QTS training I might be aiming for upon my graduation, could you take a look and suggest if that's a good thing?
http://www.edustaff.co.uk/jobs/trainee- ... ign=Indeed

Do you think that participating in this kind of training is a very competitive thing to jump into?

Best regards,
Dawid

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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by Susan » 25 Dec 2016, 17:22

Hi.

All four OU courses look good and you'll certainly learn a lot. However, by choosing early learning, you'll be limiting your job opportunities. In your case, I think you need to keep your options open. Is there an OU course on learning or pedagogy in general?

Susan
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Re: A couple of questions from a prospective teacher

Unread post by daxey » 25 Dec 2016, 17:34

Susan wrote:Hi.

All four OU courses look good and you'll certainly learn a lot. However, by choosing early learning, you'll be limiting your job opportunities. In your case, I think you need to keep your options open. Is there an OU course on learning or pedagogy in general?

Susan
Hi there,
I think there is http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/qualifica ... se-details

Also it is a list of all of the courses:
http://www.open.ac.uk/courses/

I've noticed that most of the employers prefer mostly the Educational or English related majors (particularly educational).

Best regards
Dawid

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